Talk:Battle of Jabalia

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should this page say "Palestinian Victory"

The infoboks says that Jabalia Refugee camp remained under the control of militants and that Israel had failed to dislodge them in the region. Therefore, is that not a Palestinian victory? Genabab (talk) 13:36, 26 September 2024 (UTC)[reply]

@Vbbanaz05 Can I take the revert you made as a sign that you would be willing to discuss if it should say victory or not? Genabab (talk) 19:14, 28 September 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Sources that say it is X victory? Cinderella157 (talk) 22:02, 28 September 2024 (UTC)[reply]

@Cinderella157 They say that Palestinian militants continue to control Jabalia. That seems pretty clear for their victory and not OR imo Genabab (talk) 10:19, 29 September 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Then they don't say it is X victory. You are interpreting the result as a victory. Please see WP:RESULT and Template: Infobox military conflict. There is nuance to the outcome which is best explained in prose in the body of the article and the see Aftermath option is probably best unless there are sources which would state that it was inconclusive. Cinderella157 (talk) 10:38, 29 September 2024 (UTC)[reply]

I think a little bit of wiggleroom is possible here. sure, the sources don't eplicitly say they won. But how else could we characterise Israel withdrawing from an area, where the PJOR continues to control the territory and remain combat effective? Genabab (talk) 12:29, 29 September 2024 (UTC)[reply]

We are not here to characterise the result. We are here to report how sources characterise the result. As I understand it, the IDF withdrew, incorrectly believing they had fulfilled their objective. This is what we should be saying (or something similar) as prose in the article. Per WP:RESULT, it doesn't fit with the standard terms. See Aftermath is the option to direct the reader to the appropriate section of the article. Cinderella157 (talk) 22:31, 29 September 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Extended-confirmed-protected edit request on 8 October 2024

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What I think should be changed:

I think that this page should be split into 2 pages: "Battle of Jabalia" and "Second Battle of Jabalia ".
The "Second Battle of Jabalia" should contain information about the military engagement/s of 11-31/05/2024.

Why it should be changed:

It is referenced by many reliable sources (and also by Israel) as a different "operation".

References supporting the possible change (format using the "cite" button):

Few reference to the May battle in Jabalia: BBC, reuters, The Guardian. Guy Haddad 1 (talk) 15:58, 8 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]

References

Not done: Edit requests are not for splitting proposals; see WP:SPLIT for information on that. 𝚈𝚘𝚟𝚝 (𝚝𝚊𝚕𝚔𝚟𝚝) 17:17, 9 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Poor sources

Most of this article is based on the ISW, which is not the most reliable of sources when it comes to the Gaza conflict and many of its claims should not be stated as wikivoice. Much of the rest of the article is sourced to twitter, which is even worse. Its been tagged as such as December 2023, so I'll go ahead and start removing the content and sources.VR _{(Please ping on reply)} 21:02, 10 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]