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Critique of July 2007 trims

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Whoa, what happened here? Circeus deleted the accidents that do not involve white people. Might not be NPOV (just my opinion of this arbitrary action). Nutmegger 01:16, 19 July 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Sorry I never noticed this. I moved around the time it was posted. Many of these accidents ()I happened to remove more that "[did] not involve white people" because there were less that involved white people to begin with (there are 6 accidents from Western Europe and North America in the removed list, which is on par with the frequency of these area of the worldin the whole list).
I trimmed mostly accidents with 8-20 deaths from Africa and Asia because such accidents, bar other peculiarities, are not nearly as notable when accidents with 25-40 deaths are common in these regions. We do not aim to report all the bus plunges stories, only the more notable amongst them, hence my (quite needed to keep the list manageable) trim, which also removed all the marginal cases for which I couldn't readily locate sources.
The items are all here, on the talk page, easily restored if you think they should, so it's not like I was being rogue or anything. Circeus 19:38, 1 October 2007 (UTC)[reply]

July 2007 trim

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I will remove some less notable or unsourced events from the list and put them here. Feelfree to discuss. I have rough criteria in mind, but typing them would be too long. Circeus 18:51, 10 July 2007 (UTC) The years are missing from the copied elements. See original edit or references for year placement.[reply]

References

  1. ^ a b c Shafer, Jack. "The Rise and Fall of the "Bus Plunge" Story: What Killed This Former New York Times Staple? http://www.slate.com/id/2152895" Slate.com 13 November 2006
  2. ^ 1976 Busunglück
  3. ^ a b Oberg, James E. Uncovering Soviet Disasters: Exploring the Limits of Glasnost. New York: Random House, 1988: 106.
  4. ^ "West Germans Killed in Bus Accident in Soviet Union." The Associated Press 26 July, 1983.
  5. ^ AP report via New York Times
  6. ^ Reuters "16 Die in Indian Bus Crash" The New York Times 7 April 1985
  7. ^ AP report via New York Times
  8. ^ UPI "Indian Bus Crash Kills 16" The New York Times 7 December 1986
  9. ^ Oberg, James E. Uncovering Soviet Disasters: Exploring the Limits of Glasnost. New York: Random House, 1988: 107.
  10. ^ Reuters. "Eight Die in Soviet Bus Crash" The New York Times 3 March 1987
  11. ^ Associated Press. "Bus Crash Kills 12 in India" The New York Times 12 March 1987
  12. ^ "Belgian Bus Driver Violated Traffic Rules." ITAR-TASS 15 July 1987
  13. ^ "Thick Fog Grounds Flights For A Third Day, Blamed For 11 Deaths In Crash." The Associated Press 21 October 1987.
  14. ^ Associated Press "Bus Crash in Spain Kills 10" The New York Times 17 November 1987
  15. ^ AP report via New York Times
  16. ^ BBC News Report
  17. ^ CNN report
  18. ^ CNN report
  19. ^ CNN report
  20. ^ Bus plunges off Greek road, 23 February, 2003
  21. ^ Fatal Czech bus crash, 9 March, 2003
  22. ^ AP report via phillyburbs.com
  23. ^ [1]
  24. ^ [2]
  25. ^ Spectaculaire carambolage sur l'autoroute 20: un mort, 09/09/2004
  26. ^ [3]
  27. ^ Bus crash in Ireland kills 5 girls, May 22, 2005
  28. ^ Mandatory refresher courses for commercial drivers from next year, 1 JUly 2006
  29. ^ CNN report
  30. ^ "13 killed, 16 injured in road accident in Iran" 20 September 2006
  31. ^ Reuters report
  32. ^ Reuters report
  33. ^ AP report via CBS News
  34. ^ Independent Online article
  35. ^ BBC News report
  36. ^ PakTribune.com report
  37. ^ AFP via Hindustan Times
  38. ^ Reuters report
  39. ^ "Road accident kills 13 in Iran" 26 November 2006
  40. ^ "Bus plunges into gorge in HP, 14 killed" 3 December 2006
  41. ^ "15 die, scores injured in grisly road accident" 10 December 2006
  42. ^ "Nigeria: 20 Killed in Kaduna Auto Crash" 13 December 2006
  43. ^ "17 die in Nigerian road crash" 22 December 2006
  44. ^ "14 killed as bus collides with oil tanker" 31 December 2006
  45. ^ "12 killed, over 35 injured in bus accident in Doda" 4 January 2007
  46. ^ "29 Killed in Three Months on Kashmir Roads" 10 April 2007
  47. ^ "Britons injured in coach crash" January 5, 2007.
  48. ^ "Another deadly road accident in Iran left 14 Iranians dead" 11 January 2007
  49. ^ "Sixteen Perish At Akuse Junction" 2 February 2007
  50. ^ "19 killed, 20 injured in Jammu and Kashmir road accident" 3 February 2007
  51. ^ "Tour buses collide in southern China, killing 13" 3 February 2007
  52. ^ "Brazil bus crash kills 13, injures 23 near historic city of Ouro Preto" 17 February 2007
  53. ^ "12 persons killed and nine injured in an bus accident in Jammu region" 26 February 2007
  54. ^ "Nepal bus rolls down mountainside, 13 killed" 27 February 2007
  55. ^ "Bus Falls Into Gorge in India, 18 Dead" 13 March 2007
  56. ^ "Moro accident victims identified" 17 March 2007
  57. ^ "Road accident kills 14, injures 27 in Zambia" 25 March 2007
  58. ^ "13 killed in road crash in eastern India" 27 March 2007
  59. ^ "10 dead in Zim bus crash" 11 April 2007
  60. ^ "Passenger bus falls into ravine in northwestern Pakistan, 11 killed" 14 April 2007
  61. ^ "Brazil bus crash kills 11" 16 April 2007
  62. ^ "Bus falls into gorge in India, 19 killed" 2 May 2007
  63. ^ "Road accident kills 10 in Orissa" 11 May 2007
  64. ^ "14 killed, 7 hurt in head-on road crash in Siberia" June 9, 2007
  65. ^ "12 killed in road mishap near Ghaziabad" 8 June 2007
  66. ^ "Van falls off mountain road in northwestern Pakistan, at least 12 killed" 10 Jun 2007
  67. ^ "5 Fairport 2007 Grads Killed in Head-On Collision" 26 Jun 2007
  68. ^ "1 killed and several injured in tour-bus crash near Scranton, Pennsylvania" 29 Jun 2007
  69. ^ 12 killed, 8 injured in minibus crash, 2007-07-04
  70. ^ Indonesian police: 14 dead after bus carrying students, teachers, plunges into ravine 7 July 2007

February 2009 trim

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I will remove some less notable or unsourced events from the list and put them here. Feelfree to discuss. I have rough criteria in mind, but typing them would be too long. Circeus 23:51, February 9, 2009 (UTC) The years are missing from the copied elements. See original edit or references for year placement.

1979

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March 16 2009 trim

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I will remove some less notable or unsourced events from the list and put them here. Feelfree to discuss. I have rough criteria in mind, but typing them would be too long. Circeus 10:42, March 16, 2009 (UTC) The years are missing from the copied elements.

1960

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  • Brazil June 22 – At least twenty-two died and six injured, when a local bus struck and caught fire in suburb of Porto Alegre, Brazil. [citation needed]
  • Brazil August 25 – At least fifty-nine died, when a bus carrying Don Pedro Commercial Schoo soccer club plunged into Numa Bridge spans of Turvo River, Sao Jose do Rio Pereo, state of Sao Paulo, Brazil. [citation needed]

1977

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1995

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  • Egypt April 16 – A bus carrying ninety textile factory's workers hit by an express train in level crossing at Al Minufiyah, Monufia Governorate, Egypt. At least fourty-nine people confirmed dead. [citation needed]


May 14, 2009 trim

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I will remove some less notable or unsourced events from the list and put them here. Feelfree to discuss. I have rough criteria in mind, but typing them would be too long. Circeus 10:42, March 16, 2009 (UTC) The years are missing from the copied elements.

1962

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  • Philippines May 29 – An overloaded bus with Mindanao Agricultural Colledge students, plunged into 800-foot in wooden bridge, near Alalon Fall, Bukidnon, Mindanao, Philippines, at least thirty people dead. [citation needed]

1967

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  • Philippines January 6 – A bus bump into rear of another bus, and both bus plunged into 300-foot of ravine in Silang, Cavite, Calabarzon, Philippines, and both buses carrying 130 local pilgrim members of Feast of the Three Kings. The resulting of 83 people to death. [citation needed]

May 23, 2009 trim

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I will remove some less notable or unsourced events from the list and put them here. Feelfree to discuss. I have rough criteria in mind, but typing them would be too long. Circeus 10:03, May 23, 2009 (UTC) The years are missing from the copied elements.

1968

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1978

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1989

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May 28, 2009 trim

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I will remove some less notable or unsourced events from the list and put them here. Feelfree to discuss. I have rough criteria in mind, but typing them would be too long. Circeus 14:03, May 28, 2009 (UTC) The years are missing from the copied elements.

1976

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1982

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1983

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  • Turkey July 7 – A truck carrying local farm workers, careened off a road and plunged into a ravine in Yerkoy, Yozgat, Turkey, at least fourty-four people are confirmed dead and seventeen people are injured. [citation needed]

1984

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June 3, 2009 trim

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I will remove some less notable or unsourced events from the list and put them here. Feelfree to discuss. I have rough criteria in mind, but typing them would be too long. Circeus 14:03, May 28, 2009 (UTC) The years are missing from the copied elements.

1962

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1985

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  • China May 14 – A bus carrying Huinan high-school students and teachers, collided with a truck and burst into flames in outskirt of Xiamen, Fujian, China, at least twenty-two people dead, fourty-eight people are injured. [citation needed]
  • Pakistan September 1 – An Agra-Kilgansi regular route bus lost control and plunged into a ravine with over a cliff in mountain road, outskirt of Batkhela, North-West Frontier, Pakistan, at least at least fourty people are dead. [citation needed]

1988

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  • Peru July 8 – A bus lost control, approaching sharp curve and plunged into deep george in outskirt of Matucana, Huarochiri, Peru, at least thirty people are dead with twenty are injured. [citation needed]

1989

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1995

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1997

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  • Colombia January 2 – A bus carrying fourty people onboard, plunged into a cliff, on a foggy road, and tumbling 2500-foot down a mountain road, outskirt of Carrizal, Guainia, Colombia, killing thirty-seven people. [citation needed]

June 8, 2009 trim

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I will remove some less notable or unsourced events from the list and put them here. Feelfree to discuss. I have rough criteria in mind, but typing them would be too long. Circeus 12:18, June 8, 2009 (UTC) The years are missing from the copied elements.

1982

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1983

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  • Ecuador September 11 – A bus plunge off a San Jose bridge, Ambato, Tungusahua, Ecuador, killing fifty-two people. [citation needed]
  • Italy December 8 – A bus carrying Italian sailors, returning from Serie A soccer match, crash into broke guardrails and plunged into 225-foot down a cliff by rain swept, A 33 Express way, Aulla, Tuscany, Italy, killing at least thirty-four sailors. [citation needed]

1991

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June 13, 2009 trim

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I will remove some less notable or unsourced events from the list and put them here. Feelfree to discuss. I have rough criteria in mind, but typing them would be too long. Circeus 04:18, June 13, 2009 (UTC) The years are missing from the copied elements.

1984

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  • Venezuela June 10 – A bus carrying Jauregui Military Academy of student rolled over with hit a bridge guard-railing, and caught fire in Las Mesas, Tachira, Venezuela, at least thirty-three people are confirmed dead and eight are injured. [citation needed]

1987

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  • Venezuela March 7 – At least thirty-six people are burn to death and seventeen people are injured, when an express bus burst a tire with overturned and caught fire, in La Victoria, Aragua, Venezuela. [citation needed]

1991

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1992

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1993

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  • Venezuela September 25 – A Corpoven natural gas pipeline explosion, following to many vehicles burn, during morning rush hour in Las Tejerias, Miranda, Venezuela. In an incident caused by a CANTV telephone company workers laying fiver optic cable, start to fire, at least fifty-one people dead and fourty are injured. [citation needed]

1994

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  • Venezuela December 27 – Two Caracas-Maturin of Sol de Margarita regular route bus collision, and hit by many vehicles, following to a Corpoven natural gas pipeline explosion in El Furrial, Monagas, Venezuela, at least fifty people are burn to death and thirty people are injured. [citation needed]

June 17, 2009 trim

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I will remove some less notable or unsourced events from the list and put them here. Feelfree to discuss. I have rough criteria in mind, but typing them would be too long. Circeus 12:01, June 17, 2009 (UTC) The years are missing from the copied elements.

1978

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1986

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1987

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1991

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June 21, 2009 trim

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I will remove some less notable or unsourced events from the list and put them here. Feelfree to discuss. I have rough criteria in mind, but typing them would be too long. Circeus 03:02, June 21, 2009 (UTC) The years are missing from the copied elements.

1970

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1972

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1977

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1979

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1998

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August 7, 2009 trim

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I will remove some less notable or unsourced events from the list and put them here. Feelfree to discuss. I have rough criteria in mind, but typing them would be too long. Circeus 22:10, August 7, 2009 (UTC) The years are missing from the copied elements.

1985

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  • India November 6 – A local bus carrying 127 people onboard, plunged into a 5000-foot deep valley, near Badhlidhar village, Himachal Pradesh, India, at least 82 people are dead and 40 people are injured. [citation needed]

1987

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  • Sudan May 17 – A bus plunge into Bule Nile River, when a driver missed entry ramp to a ferry terminal, El Kamlin, Al Jazirah, Sudan, at least 46 people confirmed dead. [citation needed]

August 22, 2009 trim

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I will remove some less notable or unsourced events from the list and put them here. Feelfree to discuss. I have rough criteria in mind, but typing them would be too long. Circeus 14:02, August 22, 2009 (UTC) The years are missing from the copied elements.

1958

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August 30, 2009 trim

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I will remove some less notable or unsourced events from the list and put them here. Feelfree to discuss. I have rough criteria in mind, but typing them would be too long. Circeus 17:00, August 30, 2009 (UTC) The years are missing from the copied elements.

1960

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1980

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  • Mexico March 21 – A bus carrying Roman Catholic pilgrims plunged into 300-foot down a mountainside in Las Trojes, Jalisco, Mexico, 43 people killed and 17 people injured in the crash. [citation needed]
  • Mexico April 7 – A Tijuana-Mexico City regular route bus went off the right side of bridge and plunged into a small river in Caliacan, Sinaloa de Leyva, Mexico. 48 people killed and 36 people injured in the crash. [citation needed]

1984

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  • Mexico March 12 – A bus plunged down a 20-foot embankment in Cumbres de Acutzingo, Guerrero, Mexico, in an incident caused by a bus driver lost control approaching sharp curve. 26 people killed and 19 people injured in the crash. [citation needed]

1985

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1987

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  • Mexico November 13 – An overloaded commuter bus tumbled by dense fog in San Miguel de Xico Lake, Tiahuac, Mexican Federal District, Mexico, in an incident caused by lost control and exceed speed. 40 people death with 5 injures in the crash. [citation needed]

September 19, 2009 trim

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I will remove some less notable or unsourced events from the list and put them here. Feelfree to discuss. I have rough criteria in mind, but typing them would be too long. Circeus 14:09, September 19, 2009 (UTC) The years are missing from the copied elements.

1977

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1992

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1993

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  • Nepal July 10 – An overcrowded bus plunge into irrigation canal, Sainai village, Nepal and fifty people dead in this crash. [citation needed]

October 20, 2009 trim

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I will remove some less notable or unsourced events from the list and put them here. Feelfree to discuss. I have rough criteria in mind, but typing them would be too long. Circeus 23:35, October 20, 2009 (UTC) The years are missing from the copied elements.

1952

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January 22, 2010 trim

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I will remove some less notable or unsourced events from the list and put them here. Feelfree to discuss. I have rough criteria in mind, but typing them would be too long. Circeus 11:40, January 21, 2010 (UTC) The years are missing from the copied elements.

1955

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1956

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1957

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1958

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1962

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  • India May 29 – A bus through a bridge, following plunge into Sabarmati River, Derol, Gujarat, India, which killed 69 people. [citation needed]

1968

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1969

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1973

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June 21, 2010 trim

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I will remove some less notable or unsourced events from the list and put them here. Feelfree to discuss. I have rough criteria in mind, but typing them would be too long. Circeus 10:05, June 21, 2010 (UTC) The years are missing from the copied elements.

1957

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1965

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1977

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1978

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  • Egypt July 14 – A Al-Tahrir Square of Cairo to Great Pyramids route bus swerved a trailer truck, and hit on Manial Bridge, following plunge into Nile River, Egyptian capital of Cairo, which killed 59 people and a bus driver Ali Abdel Rahman arrested of suspiction on this accident case. [citation needed]

1980

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1985

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September 9, 2010 trim

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I will remove some less notable or unsourced events from the list and put them here. Feelfree to discuss. I have rough criteria in mind, but typing them would be too long. Circeus 03:30, September 9, 2010 (UTC) The years are missing from the copied elements.

1987

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1988

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1989

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  • Brazil September 13 – A Bom Josus da Lapa-Sao Paulo route bus rammed into a truck, following a bursting from a tire, Itatiaiucu, Minas Gerais, Brazil, kills 30 with injures 14. In an incident caused by a bus driver has exssive speed. [citation needed]

Fairport Incident

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I would think it would be notable enough to make the list, it was covered by most major American news outlets (CNN, Fox, etc) Every local news source, and People Magazine as well. Links can be provided if you require. 70.101.32.218 22:17, 10 July 2007 (UTC)[reply]

It's a "human approach" story that killed 5, but is not on par with most other incident in the list. Circeus 23:10, 10 July 2007 (UTC)[reply]

User:Matt Yeager's removals

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I disagree with most of these removals.

  • First, I find that massive pileups (and 30 to 60 vehicles one are certainly large) are generally underrepresented in the current list in favor of bus plunges.
  • The Saint-Michel-de-Bellechasse incident caused outrage across the province and lead to a 3-years long public investigation with significant impact on safety regulation. The publication of the report 3 years after the accident being reported in mainstream news is proof that notability was not temporary. I'm willing to do a start article if that's necessary (I think that all incident with separate articles are automatically notable, I only removed the January 2007 one because it,s getting deleted as of now at AFD)
  • Structural failures leading to death are inherently notable. The 2000 overpass collapse is as notable as the 2006 one, just a bit less present on the web due to older date. I can settle for mentioning it in relation to the inspection drive, though. (because that wouldn't have happened without the 2000 collapse)
  • I think the circumstances of accidents may affect their notability and whether they or not be included here. Those involving natural disasters in addition to the road accident element (cf. the Mexican landslide) become more notable.
  • Bluffton accident as a (long) article at Bluffton University bus accident,which establish notability. We should probably investigate Category:Road accidents by year to make sure all of them are at least notable, or listed here if they are not on their own.

While I'm at it, what do you think of adding that tanker fire that collapsed an overpass of the oakland freeway? n:Tanker truck fire causes collapse on Oakland Freeway.

Circeus 23:08, 10 July 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Without going back and looking at the article, I agree in principle with all of Circeus's comments. I had particularly noticed about all the bus ones and am thinking of removing most of the remaining ones with fewer than 20 fatalities. Matchups 02:10, 11 July 2007 (UTC)[reply]
There are a number of reasons why a given case can be kept, though. Unusual circumstances (plodding into crowd, hazardous material explosions), poor coverage of the concerned country, and a 15 death accident does not have the same scale in, say, Danemark as in India. I tried to balance with the entries I removed (above), but it's not easy. Circeus 02:19, 11 July 2007 (UTC)[reply]
A few things. Bluffton I'm fine with--I debated a while over that, it probably should remain, I suppose. I'll even, in good faith, concede the Saint-Michel-de-Bellechasse one. And many that you added were fine. But I must disagree with you on this--an accident in India, all else being equal, means exactly the same as an accident anywhere else. Denying that means that when a person's percentage of the overall population decreases, his or her notability also decreases. Not true.
A few or even several of these accidents are really not very notable. I'm going to remove a couple. (For the record, the diff of the new placements BEFORE I began removing is this.) To sum up: a hit and run accident killing six is not notable; a 43-car pileup that leaves one dead is not notable; seven killed from a derailed train is arguably not notable; and what the heck does Eloxochitlan mean, anyway?
But let's see how this all works out. Matt Yeager (Talk?) 05:11, 12 July 2007 (UTC)[reply]
The hit and run and various road collisions that resulted in derailments have quite detailed articles that demonstrate notability. There is no excuse for exclusing them (although I have prodded or nominated for deletion a couple things in category:Road accidents. But I still strongly disagree with you: 15 deaths in an accident, everything else being equal, is still a much bigger deal in North America or Western Europe than in India. Eloxochitlan is the name of a small village near the landslide location. I can even look up the etymology if you want me to. I know where to find good Nahuatl sources. Circeus 05:19, 12 July 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Oh, so it should say "A landslide buries a bus near Eloxochitlan"... okay, that makes sense now. Anyway, the reason it seems like a bigger deal in Western culture is because, no offense, most Wikipedians on en.wikipedia.org live in Western culture and accidents locally virtually always matter more to people than faraway ones (all else being equal)... personally, though I really truly don't want this to sound insulting, I think it's demeaning to countries like India to suggest something on the order of "oh, it's no big deal, there's a billion more where those came from"... which is a decent summation of your argument for why European or American crashes mean more. (I hope that didn't sound rude... it's late, that's my only excuse.)

I acknowledge this. But I'm also arguing that death tolls above twenty are also much, much rarer generally in (to limit this) Canada and the U.S., which reduces the threshold of notability significantly. That's not a demeaning remark (Editing this list is a psychological challenge no matter where the accidents occur), it's a factual observation. Circeus 05:37, 12 July 2007 (UTC)[reply]
I hear what you're saying, but are you sure Canada and the U.S. have such a small share? I mean, added together they only have ~5% of the world's population, right? Naturally I'd expect they'd have far more than 5% of the world's crashes (think of the percentage of drivers in the U.S./Canada versus in Nigeria, Bangladesh, etc... heck, even in urban European countries most people don't drive). If we compare NA totals to the whole rest of the world, the world will have more, of course, but the ratio will be skewed. If anything, we should be careful to limit NA (and UK) accidents because of this. Matt Yeager (Talk?) 19:42, 13 July 2007 (UTC)[reply]
I must disagree with "even in urban European countries most people don't drive". What? Where on earth have you got this from? Very few British adults don't drive, and I don't think we're exactly unusual in Europe, where almost every city has a traffic problem. I agree that the trimmings were far too drastic - a serious accident is a serious accident, no matter where it happens. I think any modern accident where the death toll is in double figures and any that makes national news should qualify, and in earlier decades that threshold should be even lower. The list is never going to be complete, but so what? -- Necrothesp 09:39, 3 August 2007 (UTC)[reply]
Ahh, "urban European" was putting it badly. "In Europe, most urban dwellers don't drive" would have been better (and true). In the U.S., most working-age people cannot (or don't) take public transportation anywhere, and often drive over an hour a day. Not so in, let's say, London. As for the rest... that's pretty decent criteria. The exact number we select doesn't matter much. Matt Yeager (Talk?) 08:49, 4 August 2007 (UTC)[reply]
I suppose it depends on what you mean by "don't drive". Most European adults can drive and many do drive; even most people who live in towns own a car and drive outside (and even around) the town even if they don't drive to work every day - I don't usually drive to work (since it's only a 15-minute walk), but I own a car and drive to the supermarket, the cinema, even the city centre, since it's more convenient than taking a bus, and if I lived further away I would indeed drive to work. Maybe this is confused by the fact that in Britain "he doesn't drive" generally means "he can't drive and doesn't hold a driving licence" not "he doesn't drive on a day-to-day basis". The former is rare, the latter probably indeed less so than in North America. -- Necrothesp 09:08, 6 August 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Oh, okay. That makes more sense, I see where you're coming from now... yes, I certainly meant "most people don't tend to drive", not "most people are not physically or legally capable of driving". But in the U.S., I would bet that over 90% of workers actually drive every day to work and back, often for a half and hour (each way!) or longer. So, for mostly that reason, a U.S. crash is much, much, much more likely to occur than a European one (when you correct for the higher general population in all of Europe, of course). Maybe a U.S. crash is less likely to happen per mile driven (since U.S. drivers are more experienced, one would hope they're better, too). In either case, it doesn't really matter. But still, pretty enlightening. Thanks! Matt Yeager (Talk?) 07:22, 7 August 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Criteria?

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For the records, these are the criteria I tentatively applied:

  • Is there an article with proper assertion of notability? that is ground for instant inclusion.
  • Death toll: unless another criterion applies, a cutoff of 20 deaths seemed okay, although 15 might apply for North America and Western Europe, for reasons stated above. Consider also the number of injured.
  • Structural failure: Accidents caused by or causing structural failure of overpasses, elevated highways, bridges etc. are far more notable than regular collisions.
  • Circumstances: If the accident is definitely more than a mere vehicle-to-vehicle collision. Examples include vehicles running into crowds or buildings, or hazardous material explosions. The "steamroller falling on bus" case fell into this category (not exactly a common type of road crash!), as did the railway crossing accidents resulting in derailings. Accidents in tunnels are also unusual, and tend to be deadlier in addition to the potential economic consequences.
  • Natural event: Accidents involving a natural disaster, such as avalanches, floods, landslides... The Mexican landslide and Colorado avalanche are unusual and rare events that lend further notability.
  • Consequences: Did the accident have significant social or political consequences? The M40 minivan crash is a good example of both. The Éboulements bus crash, in addition to its death toll, created further controversy when ecologists opposed the complete redesign of the road near the site.
  • Large pileups, even with smaller death toll, are far more notable than smaller-scale events (and are overall much underrepresented.)
  • Record setting: Is the accident setting a record for the country?
  • Country coverage: How large is our coverage of the country? If this is the single incident we have, it is more notable than if we already have a dozen others.

There are probably some other things I am forgetting, but these seems sensible to consider when working on this list. Circeus 05:37, 12 July 2007 (UTC)[reply]

This is a good start. The list should not become an updated list of bus plunges, of which every day one seems to happen in underdeveloped countries.
I think what should be the criterium, is the relative impact of the society it happened in, not the absolute death toll. A huge pileup in dense fog makes a much bigger impression on people than just one tourist bus ending up in the ditch, because the driver fell asleep.
Also, what should be considered, is a separate article for level crossing accidents, where both train and road traffic are involved. That should shorten both the List of rail accidents and List of road accidents. --Brinkie 10:25, 13 July 2007 (UTC)[reply]
As far as I can see, any accident that makes national news in the country in which it happens is worthy of inclusion. That's a pretty good indicator of how important it's seen to be. -- Necrothesp 09:55, 3 August 2007 (UTC)[reply]
Im sorry, but is this article for real? I think that there must be very strict guidlines as to what to add, and perhaps there needs to be separate articles for each nation. This article is too long and can only get longer. Please lets discuss the possiblility of having a standard criteria for inclusion or else anything added will only dilute the next addition.--Jojhutton (talk) 21:11, 24 September 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Grammatical Errors

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I've noticed many grammatical errors on this page

Verb tenses

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I've been working my way through this article tidying it up and adding references where I can. However, the various contributors have had somewhat different ideas about verb tenses - some have entered things in the past tense (ie '1956 - a bus crashed into a camel and 68 people died') while the majority have used the present tense (ie '1956 - a bus crashes into a camel, killing 68 people'). In the interest of consistency I've been changing everything to the latter - if anyone has a better idea please say so. ~ mazca talk 12:51, 21 June 2008 (UTC)[reply]

According to http://www.francisfrith.com/search/england/kent/monkton/, "Minster has the dubious claim to fame of being the site of the world’s first fatal motor-car accident". I am unable to find more information about it, as insufficient details are given on the page to provide useful search terms. The quote is an extract from a book, "Thanet Pocket Album" by Helen Livingston (ISBN 1-85937-718-1). However, if the information is correct I would also expect it to be mentioned in other sources. If it is correct the accident should probably be in the list; does anyone have more information about it? --Snigbrook (talk) 23:29, 29 June 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Thank you for maintaining this article

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I am a frequent traveler to poor countries and understand the most dangerous risk any traveler (who doesn't take unusually dumb risks) can take is riding on buses. Anytime I feel cheap and want to avoid buying a plane ticket, I refer to this article. When I make my India trip, there is no way in hell I'll take anything but the train. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 81.178.65.22 (talk) 16:46, 13 August 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Chappaquiddick

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I included the Chappaquiddick incident as a notable automobile wreck, given that it had large political implications. 68.32.48.221 (talk) 20:12, 26 August 2009 (UTC)[reply]

I think Kennedy should be listed on a separate page (linked to this one) of serious accidents involving notable personages. E.g. Matthew Broderick, James Dean, Princess Grace, Princess Di, Mark Hamill, Morgan Freeman... Thoughts? —Preceding unsigned comment added by Schnitzi (talkcontribs) 12:45, 18 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]

I didn't know how else to post on here but I wanted to add an accident from Canada to this list. 22 young men were killed in a fiery crash on the Trans Canada on May 28, 1980 near Swift Current, Sk. Please see this link. http://www.thetelegram.com/Arts---Life/Commuting/2009-04-17/article-1438412/Bus-tragedy-still-painful/1 — Preceding unsigned comment added by 128.233.88.90 (talk) 15:48, 6 February 2012 (UTC)[reply]

Renaming article

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Since we have articles about road accidents from 2000-2009 and 2010-2019, I'm wondering if we should rename this article to something like List of road accidents 1700-1999. Any thoughts? Paul MacDermott (talk) 13:33, 7 November 2011 (UTC)[reply]

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"List of car crashes" listed at Redirects for discussion

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An editor has identified a potential problem with the redirect List of car crashes and has thus listed it for discussion. This discussion will occur at Wikipedia:Redirects for discussion/Log/2022 November 18#List of car crashes until a consensus is reached, and readers of this page are welcome to contribute to the discussion. MB 05:13, 18 November 2022 (UTC)[reply]

"List of road accidents" listed at Redirects for discussion

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An editor has identified a potential problem with the redirect List of road accidents and has thus listed it for discussion. This discussion will occur at Wikipedia:Redirects for discussion/Log/2022 November 18#List of road accidents until a consensus is reached, and readers of this page are welcome to contribute to the discussion. Regards, SONIC678 15:38, 18 November 2022 (UTC)[reply]