User talk:MathTeller

Welcome, MathTeller!

Have a plate of cookies!

Welcome to Wikipedia, MathTeller! I'm Liance, and I've been assigned as your mentor. About half of new Wikipedia accounts receive a mentor chosen randomly from a list of volunteers. It just means I'm here to help with anything you need! We need to have all kinds of people working together to create an online encyclopedia, so I'm glad you're here. Over time, you will figure out what you enjoy doing the most on Wikipedia.

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If you need assistance with anything or have any questions, click on the "Get editing help" button on the bottom right corner of your screen. This will open up a module with links to help pages and a place to ask me questions. You can also ask me questions directly on my talk page, or go here to get help from the wider community.

Again, welcome to Wikipedia! ~Liance^talk 16:49, 2 October 2024 (UTC)

Hi Liance,

Thank you for the email and the cookie! I will reach out when I have questions :)

Cheers,

MathTeller MathTeller (talk) 02:10, 3 October 2024 (UTC)

@Liance

Hi Liance, I need your advice. In nutshell, I created a webpage, he flagged the page for the lack of notability. I asked him questions, but it seems like a senior persona threatened me. How should one proceed? Thank you!

Please see my conversation with him below.

Hi MathTeller. Thank you for your work on Giulio Tiozzo. Another editor, Ldm1954, has reviewed it as part of new pages patrol and left the following comment:

This page is very, very marginal for notability. The Olympics are when he was in high school, and not that notable. The Sloan is a starter grant, and not notable. The Aisenstadt is closer to notable, but it is still junior.

To reply, leave a comment here and begin it with ...(Message delivered via the Page Curation tool, on behalf of the reviewer.) Ldm1954 (talk) 19:50, 4 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Ldm1954: Hi Ldm1954,

Thank you for the message. I am confused with the comments. We are talking about people in mathematics.

The international Mathematical Olympics are the most prestigious competitions according to the wikipedia. We cannot ignore its notability. Why is that the Sloan fellowship (very different than the Sloan grant) is not notable? Only a few of best mathematicians can achieve the Sloan fellowship. This is from their webpage

"The two-year $75,000 fellowships are awarded annually to early-career researchers whose creativity, innovation, and research accomplishments make them stand out as the next generation of leaders."

I am new here and not familiar with procedure. I appreciate it if you can provide suggestions to ensure the page doesn't get removed.

Thanks!

MathTeller MathTeller (talk) 21:34, 4 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]

You need to carefully look at WP:NPROF. We look for senior awards such as being elected a Fellow in a major society, election to the national academy and/or a very strong publication record. The International Mathematical Olympics are for high school students, they are not senior awards. The Sloan is an early-career grant, it is not a senior award. The Aisenstadt is closer, although I am not convinced that it is strong enough. While he has made a good start to his career, as the tag I added says, it is not clear if he is notable enough for Wikipedia.

What you need to do is find other sources which indicate that he is notable. Unfortunately that may be very hard. Ldm1954 (talk) 21:51, 4 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Ldm1954 Thanks for the advise.

I'm looking at WP:NPROF, it doesn't use word "senior". FYI, the most prestigious award in mathematics is the Fields medal given to non-senior mathematicians. However according to part e in WP:NPROF, Sloan Fellowship (not Sloan grant) is eligible: "For the purposes of partially satisfying Criterion 1, significant academic awards and honors may include, for example: major academic awards (they would also automatically satisfy Criterion 2), highly selective fellowships (other than postdoctoral fellowships);" MathTeller (talk) 22:20, 4 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]

No. The Sloan has been discussed, and is a startup grant with an incorrect name. Senior grants are being elected fellow, NAE, FRS, Fields etc.

I suggest that you don't try and fight me on this. Ldm1954 (talk) 22:38, 4 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Ldm1954 I don't think we are in a position to change the names of prizes and interpret them differently than the institute awarded them. We shouldn't project our opinions. If it is discussed, whatever that means, it should be in the guideline.

Can you please clarify what do you mean but "I suggest that you don't try and fight me on this". Is that a threat? Are you suggesting no one should ask questions here? MathTeller (talk) 23:03, 4 October 2024

MathTeller (talk) 23:20, 4 October 2024 (UTC)

I never threatened you. There was no requirement for me to respond to you in the first place, I only did because you are a novice and asked for advice. You challenged my advice, indicating that you felt that I was wrong. I did suggest that you not pick a fight since what I was telling you is accepted concensus; see WT:NPROF. Please read the five pillars of Wikipedia before you start making accusations.

New page patrol is a standard part of Wikipedia. Particularly new biographies are looked at very carefully. By only marking the page for notability I was giving you the chance to improve a page which might not be notable. Harsher steps are to move it to a draft or nominate it for deletion. I know many reviewers who would have marked it for deletion (and they still may). Ldm1954 (talk) 00:39, 5 October 2024 (UTC)

I have sent you a note about a page you started

Hi MathTeller. Thank you for your work on Giulio Tiozzo. Another editor, Ldm1954, has reviewed it as part of new pages patrol and left the following comment:

This page is very, very marginal for notability. The Olympics are when he was in high school, and not that notable. The Sloan is a starter grant, and not notable. The Aisenstadt is closer to notable, but it is still junior.

To reply, leave a comment here and begin it with {{Re|Ldm1954}}. (Message delivered via the Page Curation tool, on behalf of the reviewer.)

Ldm1954 (talk) 19:50, 4 October 2024 (UTC)

@Ldm1954: Hi Ldm1954,

Thank you for the message. I am confused with the comments. We are talking about people in mathematics.

The international Mathematical Olympics are the most prestigious competitions according to the wikipedia. We cannot ignore its notability. Why is that the Sloan fellowship (very different than the Sloan grant) is not notable? Only a few of best mathematicians can achieve the Sloan fellowship. This is from their webpage

"The two-year $75,000 fellowships are awarded annually to early-career researchers whose creativity, innovation, and research accomplishments make them stand out as the next generation of leaders."

I am new here and not familiar with procedure. I appreciate it if you can provide suggestions to ensure the page doesn't get removed.

Thanks!

MathTeller MathTeller (talk) 21:34, 4 October 2024 (UTC)

You need to carefully look at WP:NPROF. We look for senior awards such as being elected a Fellow in a major society, election to the national academy and/or a very strong publication record. The International Mathematical Olympics are for high school students, they are not senior awards. The Sloan is an early-career grant, it is not a senior award. The Aisenstadt is closer, although I am not convinced that it is strong enough. While he has made a good start to his career, as the tag I added says, it is not clear if he is notable enough for Wikipedia.

What you need to do is find other sources which indicate that he is notable. Unfortunately that may be very hard. Ldm1954 (talk) 21:51, 4 October 2024 (UTC)

@Ldm1954 Thanks for the advise.

I'm looking at WP:NPROF, it doesn't use word "senior". FYI, the most prestigious award in mathematics is the Fields medal given to non-senior mathematicians. However according to part e in WP:NPROF, Sloan Fellowship (not Sloan grant) is eligible: "For the purposes of partially satisfying Criterion 1, significant academic awards and honors may include, for example: major academic awards (they would also automatically satisfy Criterion 2), highly selective fellowships (other than postdoctoral fellowships);" MathTeller (talk) 22:20, 4 October 2024 (UTC)

No. The Sloan has been discussed, and is a startup grant with an incorrect name. Senior grants are being elected fellow, NAE, FRS, Fields etc.

I suggest that you don't try and fight me on this. Ldm1954 (talk) 22:38, 4 October 2024 (UTC)

@Ldm1954 I don't think we are in a position to change the names of prizes and interpret them differently than the institute awarded them. We shouldn't project our opinions. If it is discussed, whatever that means, it should be in the guideline.

Can you please clarify what do you mean but "I suggest that you don't try and fight me on this". Is that a threat? Are you suggesting no one should ask questions here? MathTeller (talk) 23:03, 4 October 2024 (UTC)

If you are questioning the information I gave about the general community concensus on what is notable, please post your argument about the Sloan and any others to WT:NPROF. Ldm1954 (talk) 23:17, 4 October 2024 (UTC)