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Talk:2024 Hezbollah headquarters strike/Archive 1

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Archive 1

Extended-confirmed-protected edit request on 28 September 2024

Nasrallah is dead. Namnaam (talk) 08:19, 28 September 2024 (UTC)

 Not done: It's not clear what changes you want to be made. Please put what changes you want made in a "change X to Y" format.</MarkiPoli> <talk /><cont /> 09:12, 28 September 2024 (UTC)

Why is this an article?

We still have very little information, the dust still hasn't settled. Either delete this article, rename it or merge it into another article. We still don't know if Nasrallah is dead or not apart from hearsay from the IDF. No evidence has yet been presented by either sides. Disregard this section, Nasrallah has been confirmed dead by Hezbollah themselves in a statement. TwistedAxe [contact] 09:46, 28 September 2024 (UTC)

Operation named "New Order"

The assassination operation was named "New Order" (Hebrew: "סדר חדש")

Sources:

https://x.com/idfonline/status/1839945167354163378 (IDF Hebrew twitter account)

https://www.timesofisrael.com/liveblog_entry/idf-says-operation-to-kill-nasrallah-was-code-named-new-order/ (Times of Israel news report) Redbeansoup (talk) 11:37, 28 September 2024 (UTC)

Possible to mention the operation code name in the article? Redbeansoup (talk) 11:38, 28 September 2024 (UTC)
Yes, very good piece of information to add. You can add it yourself or add it and let someone else polish it. TwistedAxe [contact] 11:47, 28 September 2024 (UTC)
Well unfortunately I'm not an extended confirmed user. But thanks. Redbeansoup (talk) 20:19, 28 September 2024 (UTC)
Can someone transliterate? Bitspectator ⛩️ 11:54, 28 September 2024 (UTC)
Done. Should be in the article now. TwistedAxe [contact] 12:00, 28 September 2024 (UTC)
Hebrew speaker here. I fixed - it's "Seder Hadash". Seder סדר = order, and Hadash חדש = new Galamore (talk) 12:49, 28 September 2024 (UTC)

"intended target"

The term "intended target" is used in the sentence, "Media reports confirmed that Hezbollah leader Hassan Nasrallah was the intended target of the airstrike."

This is redundant. When referring to a target, intention is understood. There is no such thing as an unintended target.

Recommend deleting the word, "intended" thus: "Media reports confirmed that Hezbollah leader Hassan Nasrallah was the target of the airstrike" 67.188.128.95 (talk) 05:02, 30 September 2024 (UTC)

 Done Nythar (💬-🍀) 06:21, 30 September 2024 (UTC)

Request to change 5,000 to 2,000 reflecting consensus of more recent sources


  • What I think should be changed (format using {{textdiff}}): Change the 3 instances of "5,000-pound" to "2,000-pound" (specifically in lead, infobox, and attack sections). Also should remove the associated "created in 2001" in the body as 1-ton bunker buster is older.

It is probably good idea to note in body that the exact munition is unconfirmed (see NYTimes reporting) but that's not part of this request just an option. If editor desires, can leave a reference to 5,000 pound bombs attributed to Elijah Magnier. But all the major media today are saying 2,000 (and if there are 80 bombs, probably a mix with some smaller but going further than claiming that 2,000 pound was used and ~80 bombs dropped is pure speculation).

  • Why it should be changed: Almost ever major paper is now reporting the strike was likely with 2,000 pound bombs, including surpisingly one of the 2 citations used to say 5,000 pound bombs in the lead (https://apnews.com/article/lebanon-israel-hezbollah-airstrikes-suburb-617575d9c5d7c711bc02e7b81d2ba4ad). See also the latest report from NYTimes using released videos likely of the plane along with multiple expert opinions (https://www.nytimes.com/2024/09/28/world/middleeast/israel-nasrallah-bunker-buster-bombs.html?smid=url-share), along with a consensus with AP news and every other source I've seen. The only place I'm seeing 5,000 pound is the Al Jazeera live blog only cited in the Wiki body, which attributes the statement to "Elijah Magnier, a military analyst". I could be missing another place but it's not presently in the article, and would contradict all major recent sources. If the statement is kept then it should definitely be POV to Magnier (and/or the Iranian FM) as it disagrees with the size quoted in most sources and also was a live-blog in-the-moment analysis (so no discredit to Magnier).

The refs below don't go with this, they seem to have been imported from some earlier section if someone wants to fix, sorry not sure how. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Scienceturtle1 (talk • contribs) 03:57, 29 September 2024 (UTC)

Do we even need that much detail? At least in the lede, that info could probably be removed altogether. If the majority of sources are now saying 2,000lb, then I'd be happy with that being changed. Lewisguile (talk) 08:33, 29 September 2024 (UTC)

Scienceturtle1 (talk) 22:20, 28 September 2024 (UTC)

References

 Done ARandomName123 (talk)Ping me! 18:13, 29 September 2024 (UTC)

Extended-confirmed-protected edit request on 30 September 2024

First paragraph sentence including “Conducted by the Israeli Air Force's 119th Squadron using F-16I fighters” should read “F-15I fighters” instead. The plane ID is incorrect. CNYnative (talk) 01:45, 30 September 2024 (UTC)

Done. Lewisguile (talk) 14:09, 30 September 2024 (UTC)

The attack was conducted by the 69th squadron using f15i, not f16i as currently stated in the lede. https://www.washingtonpost.com/world/2024/09/29/israel-bomb-beirut-nasrallah-death/ 77.137.79.61 (talk) 21:43, 29 September 2024 (UTC)

The attack: More facts

I have no permission to edit. A few more facts from a reliable Israeli source (Hevrat HaHadashot and reuters):

  1. It was F15i jet fighters.
  2. The bombs number was 83 1-ton bombs, not 15.
  3. His body was found with no injuries or wounds. according to some estimates the cause of his death was suffocation.

Source: [1]. לידך, בלעדייך (talk) 15:01, 29 September 2024 (UTC)

Do you have the direct link to Reuters confirming those details? That would probably be easier to use. I can't find a link in the article. Lewisguile (talk) 15:19, 29 September 2024 (UTC)
This is the reuters link, a partial source: [2]. The other information by Nir Dvori, the military reporter of "Hevrat HaHadashot". He has his sources in the IDF. לידך, בלעדייך (talk) 15:27, 29 September 2024 (UTC)
Thank you. This backs up that his body has been retrieved without any injuries. If any other links come through, feel free to add them here (though I'm sure others will add them too).a Lewisguile (talk) 15:33, 29 September 2024 (UTC)
Have added that the body has been found. Thank you! Lewisguile (talk) 15:40, 29 September 2024 (UTC)
The first link in my original post backs up all. I didn't know that only sources in the english language are used. I remember i saw sources in many languages in English Wikipedia. לידך, בלעדייך (talk) 15:40, 29 September 2024 (UTC)
We can use non-English-language sources, but rely on translations (sadly, my Hebrew skills are nonexistent and Google Translate can introduce errors). However, we generally prefer to find multiple sources to back up each source anyway, so if we'd found the original Reuters article confirming everything, we'd have had two sources to use instead of one, that's all.
I can see that the detail about the bombs has been added to the lede already (it says "more than 80"). I have also now made the change re: F15I fighters, as there are multiple other sources available now which back that up.
Thank you for your patience! Lewisguile (talk) 14:08, 30 September 2024 (UTC)
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